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Thread: Dark matter and energy, does it exist??

  1. #1
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    Default Dark matter and energy, does it exist??

    It does not, please show me proof if u think it does exist. Thanks.

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    Default Re: Dark matter and energy, does it exist??

    Quote Originally Posted by Jason me View Post
    It does not, please show me proof if u think it does exist. Thanks.
    Waiting, can reply to this any time bro.

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    Default Re: Dark matter and energy, does it exist??

    You do not understand what the word "proof" means in this setting. Bro.

    To prove something means to make it absolute.

    Science does not deal in absolutes.

    Are you meaning to ask for evidence in favor of Dark Matter or Dark Energy?
    --Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges--
    “Science needs the light of free expression to flourish. It depends on the fearless questioning of authority, and the open exchange of ideas.” ― Neil deGrasse Tyson

    "When photons interact with electrons, they are interacting with the charge around a "bare" mass, and thus the interaction is electromagnetic, hence light. This light slows the photon down." - BuleriaChk

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    Default Re: Dark matter and energy, does it exist??

    Quote Originally Posted by Jason me View Post
    It does not, please show me proof if u think it does exist. Thanks.
    In addition to Neverfly, look here

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    Default Re: Dark matter and energy, does it exist??

    Emp please just post link i dont open gifs. Open ended opportunity for virus.

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    Moderator Neverfly's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dark matter and energy, does it exist??

    Quote Originally Posted by Jason me View Post
    Emp please just post link i dont open gifs. Open ended opportunity for virus.

    The link leads here:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galaxy_rotation_curve

    Specifically, this image:

    --Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges--
    “Science needs the light of free expression to flourish. It depends on the fearless questioning of authority, and the open exchange of ideas.” ― Neil deGrasse Tyson

    "When photons interact with electrons, they are interacting with the charge around a "bare" mass, and thus the interaction is electromagnetic, hence light. This light slows the photon down." - BuleriaChk

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    Default Re: Dark matter and energy, does it exist??

    Quote Originally Posted by Neverfly View Post
    You do not understand what the word "proof" means in this setting. Bro.

    To prove something means to make it absolute.

    Science does not deal in absolutes.

    Are you meaning to ask for evidence in favor of Dark Matter or Dark Energy?
    Both dark matter and dark energy tks. Preferably some proof that is not calculated. Meaning someone didnt just put in x = dark matter or dark energy becuse they dont understand how gravity in space works.

    Don't get me wrong Neverfly i think your a smart guy. Thats actually why i struggle to try to understang how you can actually have/keep your opinion on somthing that you probably know is wrong. I think its the fear of being wrong that actually keeps you believing in the current theory of our universe. Because most of it MAY/should be correct.

    Dark matter and dark energy is wrong though. In my opinion anyway.

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    Default Re: Dark matter and energy, does it exist??

    Quote Originally Posted by Neverfly View Post
    The link leads here:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galaxy_rotation_curve

    Specifically, this image:

    Exactly what im saying. Thanks for posting the gif Neverfly and thanks for posting that Emp. What someone expected to see is not what they see. So they make up something to fill in the blank. X= dark energy/matter.

    Nope I think someone didnt know how to add it up.
    Neverfly likes this.

  9. #9
    Moderator Neverfly's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dark matter and energy, does it exist??

    Quote Originally Posted by Jason me View Post
    Both dark matter and dark energy tks. Preferably some proof that is not calculated. Meaning someone didnt just put in x = dark matter or dark energy becuse they dont understand how gravity in space works.
    This is part of your problem, though. You are running with assumptions because you do not understand how space or gravity works but the cosmologists have a much better understanding than you do.
    You seem to have difficulty accepting this, and therefor conclude that they are ignorant and then pulled some Dark Stuff out of their asses.
    Simply, you not understanding cosmology does not make you less intelligent. I bet you are not losing I.Q. points from not knowing 1920's Russian Culture music, either.
    So, I really do not understand your need to think that intellect is involved in anyway.
    Knowledge and understanding are involved, though. Ignorance is normal: I'm sure Einstein was very ignorant about ancient Hawaiian traditions and he was a pretty smart guy.
    It is perfectly acceptable that you Doubt cosmological models. But that doubt should lead toward you trying more to understand it, first.

    The answers must be calculated. The mathematical models are required. There is no dodging the math. Mathematics is itself, a very precise modeling tool and if you want an answer that is not calculated... You're S.O.L.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jason me View Post
    Don't get me wrong Neverfly i think your a smart guy. Thats actually why i struggle to try to understang how you can actually have/keep your opinion on somthing that you probably know is wrong. I think its the fear of being wrong that actually keeps you believing in the current theory of our universe. Because most of it MAY/should be correct.
    Not at all.
    Again, your terminology is flawed. We are not discussing eachothers opinions. If we were talking opinions, we'd talk about politics or have a discussion about ethics or morality or how to make command decisions in a leadership position. These are areas in which there is no "right" or "wrong" answer and very limited predictability on outcome.
    But this topic is Science. It's a precise field. Predictable outcomes are essential to support a working model. There are clearly defined boundaries between "right" and "wrong." This is not the realm of opinion, it is the realm of accuracy.

    Science does not fear being wrong: The goal of the scientific method is to build the Most Accurate Model of a system, therefor being shown that there is something wrong means corrections can be made and greater accuracy achieved.

    Now, if you want an opinion from me, here one is:
    I think you are ignorant about the topic and you need to not only learn about it, but you also need to be willing to learn about it. Until you are willing to see with eyes open, no one can show you the evidence. That's called Bias and bias is the primary issue that the Scientific Method was developed to resolve.
    Last edited by Neverfly; 11-07-2016 at 02:54 AM. Reason: There were two very annoying typos...
    --Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges--
    “Science needs the light of free expression to flourish. It depends on the fearless questioning of authority, and the open exchange of ideas.” ― Neil deGrasse Tyson

    "When photons interact with electrons, they are interacting with the charge around a "bare" mass, and thus the interaction is electromagnetic, hence light. This light slows the photon down." - BuleriaChk

  10. #10
    Moderator Neverfly's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dark matter and energy, does it exist??

    Quote Originally Posted by Jason me View Post
    Exactly what im saying. Thanks for posting the gif Neverfly and thanks for posting that Emp. What someone expected to see is not what they see. So they make up something to fill in the blank. X= dark energy/matter.

    Nope I think someone didnt know how to add it up.
    Well expressed.
    You doubt the Lambda CDM model because you feel like they threw in some made up magic in order to account for observation.
    That makes sense.
    But allow me to give you a bit of perspective: What causes Gravity?
    We know an awful lot about gravity. We can very precisely measure its effect. We use these measurements and calculations in order to model systems and predict outcomes: Successfully. Every probe launched to extra terresitral destination relies on this precision. From Pioneer to New Horizons, this utilization of the working model mathematically produced predictable and verified results. The probes reached their targets and these are not easy calculations to compute.
    This includes using the effect of gravity to accelerate objects, cancellation of gravity using Lagrangian points and targeting multiple objects in one lengthy trip across vast distances.
    Imagine if you hop on a sailing vessel in Los Angeles and aim for Australia but your calculations are only 1 degree off at the start. You'll miss the entire continent. That distance is nothing compared to what these "celestial mechanics" are calculating.
    We have working and practical knowledge of how gravity propagates in space, the rates of acceleration for masses and how gravity interacts with multiple objects.
    But no one has any idea what the cause of gravity is.
    The cause of Gravity is as mysterious and perplexing as Dark matter. Or Dark energy. The mystery is the cause of the action, not the action itself which is well observed.
    Because you live here, dealing with the effect of gravity all day every day, you do not doubt gravity is there, do you?
    Last edited by Neverfly; 11-07-2016 at 02:47 AM.
    --Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges--
    “Science needs the light of free expression to flourish. It depends on the fearless questioning of authority, and the open exchange of ideas.” ― Neil deGrasse Tyson

    "When photons interact with electrons, they are interacting with the charge around a "bare" mass, and thus the interaction is electromagnetic, hence light. This light slows the photon down." - BuleriaChk

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